The fight against Newspeak

Comprehending laws and contracts is impossible, unless we first learn the meaning of the words and phrases they contain.

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Firestarter
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The evolving New Testament

Post by Firestarter »

Maybe this will even convince some of the staunchest supporters of the “holy” church that the Bible isn’t God’s word, but merely the word of the church…


Council of Nicaea – Constantine
In about 321, Roman Emperor Constantine the Great was initiated into the order of Sol Invictus cult that regarded the Sun as the one and only Supreme God.
After Constantine conquered the East in 324, he saw an opportunity to create a new and combined State religion, protected by law, and issued a decree commanding all presbyters and their subordinates "be mounted on asses, mules and horses belonging to the public, and travel to the city of Nicaea" in the Roman province of Bithynia in Asia Minor and take their texts to the rabble, "bound in leather" for protection during the long journey, and surrender them to Constantine upon arrival in Nicaea. Their writings totalled, "in all, two thousand two hundred and thirty-one scrolls and legendary tales of gods and saviors, together with a record of the doctrines orated by them".

Constantine instructed Eusebius to convene the first of 3 sittings of the Council of Nicaea on the summer solstice, 21 June 325, and it was "held in a hall in Osius's palace".
The Council of Nicaea at first didn’t reach consensus on the new deity but instead narrowed it down to a shortlist of 5: Caesar; Krishna; Mithra; Horus; Zeus.
Constantine ruled that the name of the great Druid god, Hesus, be joined with the Hindu Saviour-god, Krishna (Krishna is Sanskrit for Christ). The name Hesus Krishna was accepted as the official name of the new Roman god, with a majority of 161 votes to 157. The name later evolved into "Jesus Christ".

Constantine instructed Eusebius to organise the uniform collection from the more than 2000 religious scrolls submitted at the council. Eusebius effectively joined the orations of Eastern and Western presbyters "to form a new universal belief" and had the ”god" stories of Mithra and Krishna merged with British Culdean beliefs. In ca. 331 the "New Testimonies” are the first historical record of the New Testament. Constantine decreed that the New Testimonies would thereafter be called the "word of the Roman Saviour God" and official to all presbyters sermonizing in the Roman Empire.
Constantine ordered earlier presbyterial manuscripts and the records of the council "burnt" and declared that "any man found concealing writings should be stricken off from his shoulders".

When Eusebius assembled scribes to write the New Testimonies, he first produced a single document, which is now called the Gospel of Mark. The Church admits that the Gospel of Mark was "the first Gospel written" (Catholic Encyclopedia, Farley ed.); today it appears second in the New Testament.

According to Dr. Von Tischendorf and Professor Bordeaux, Vatican findings reveal that the allegory of Jesus Christ derived from the fable of Mithra, “the divine son of God”.

The Second Council of Nicaea in 786-87 tried to annul "decisions passed by men with troubled brains" of the First Council of Nicaea and denounced it as, "a synod of fools and madmen".
Dr. Richard Watson concluded that "the clergy at the Council of Nicaea were all under the power of the devil, and the convention was composed of the lowest rabble and patronized the vilest abominations".


Church admits New Testament from 4th century
Bizarrely the Catholic Church has admitted that the “authenticity” of the New Testament is dubious.
See some quotes from the Catholic Encyclopedia, Farley ed.:
Our documentary sources of knowledge about the origins of Christianity and its earliest development are chiefly the New Testament Scriptures, the authenticity of which we must, to a great extent, take for granted.

(…) the most distinguished body of academic opinion ever assembled [admits that the Gospels] do not go back to the first century of the Christian era.

(…) the earliest of the extant manuscripts [of the New Testament], it is true, do not date back beyond the middle of the fourth century AD.

(…) the conclusion of Mark is admittedly not genuine ... almost the entire section is a later compilation.


Oldest Bible – Sinaiticus
On 4 February 1859, Dr. Constantin von Tischendorf (1815-1874) discovered 346 leaves of an ancient codex at St Catherine's monastery at Mt Sinai, written in Greek on donkey skins, scheduled to be burned. Archaeologists have dated it at around the year 380.
This is the oldest version of the Bible, containing both the Old and New Testaments, called the Codex Sinaiticus (Sinai Bible).
Image

The New Testament Sinaiticus contains 14,800 editorial alterations compared to a modern-day New Testament.
The Sinaiticus begins with the Gospel of Mark, which was the "first" story on Jesus Christ in the New Testament. It starts with Jesus "at about the age of thirty" (Mark 1:9), and doesn't include Mary, a virgin birth or the mass murder of baby boys by Herod.
In contrast to today's editions (Mark 1:1), Jesus Christ is not described as "the son of God", and the "messianic bloodline" isn’t traced back to King David.

No supernatural resurrection of Jesus Christ is recorded in the ancient Gospels of Mark. Not only are those narratives missing from the Sinaiticus, but also from the Alexandrian Bible, the Vatican Bible, the Bezae Bible and an ancient Latin manuscript of Mark, code-named "K" by analysts. This is also absent from the oldest Armenian version of the New Testament, in sixth-century manuscripts in Ethiopic and ninth-century Anglo-Saxon Bibles.
Some 12th-century Gospels include the now-taught resurrection verses.

Maybe even more damaging, one could argue that the Sinaiticus simply missed some pages, is that there were 3 Gospels that have since been deleted: 1) the Shepherd of Hermas (written by resurrected ghosts Charinus and Lenthius); 2) the Missive of Barnabas; and 3) the Odes of Solomon.


Evolving New Testament
The original New Testimonies of Constantine were continually expanded during the following centuries, and "interpolations" were added or changed.

The scribes of the Gospels of Matthew and Luke depended upon the Mark Gospel.
The Gospel of John is independent of those writings, and was written later to support the earlier writings. The final chapter of the Gospel of John (21) is a sixth-century addition, entirely devoted to Jesus' resurrection.
The Church admits in the Catholic Encyclopedia, and New Catholic Encyclopedia:
The sole conclusion that can be deduced from this is that the 21st chapter was afterwards added and is therefore to be regarded as an appendix to the Gospel.

Arguably the most important addition is that in 397 John "golden-mouthed" Chrysostom restructured the writings of Apollonius of Tyana, a first-century wandering sage, and included them in the “new” New Testimonies. The Latinized name for Apollonius is Paulus (who in English is then called Paul). Apollonius's personal attendant, the Assyrian scribe Damis, is Demis in the “new” New Testament.
These days the “holy” Church calls those writings the Epistles of Paul.

St Jerome (who died in 420) declared that the the fifth book of the New Testament, Acts of the Apostles, was also "falsely written".


Vatican corrections – 1562, 1587
In 1562, the Vatican established the censoring unit called Index Expurgatorius. Its purpose was to delete "erroneous passages of the early Church Fathers" that opposed “modern-day” doctrine. When Vatican archivists came across, "genuine copies of the Fathers, they corrected them according to the Expurgatory Index".
In 1587, Pope Sixtus V (1585-90) established an official Vatican publishing division and explained "Church history will be now be established ... we shall seek to print our own account".

Professor Edmond S. Bordeaux in “How The Great Pan Died” wrote:
The Church ante-dated all her late works, some newly made, some revised and some counterfeited, which contained the final expression of her history ... her technique was to make it appear that much later works written by Church writers were composed a long time earlier, so that they might become evidence of the first, second or third centuries.
https://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/bibl ... zar_40.htm
(http://archive.is/V4IqA)


I’m curious on when the “new definition” for Jews was first inserted into the New Testament: https://www.lawfulpath.com/forum/viewto ... =23&t=1376


The story of Jesus Christ's trial is highly suspicious. It is claimed, by the Romans, that the Roman Pontius Pilate was some sort of saint, who desperately tried to save Jesus but was coerced into obeying the demands of the Jews to execute Jesus.
The whole notion that the Romans would give Jews the choice of freeing guilty criminals at Passover (or any other time of the year) is preposterous.

The historical Pontius Pilate was a despot, who hated Jews and never delegated any authority to them.
However, in Christian mythology, he is portrayed as a concerned ruler who distanced himself from the vile accusations against Jesus.

According the myth, Pilate gave the Jews the choice of freeing Jesus Christ or a murderer named Jesus Barabbas. The Jews allegedly enthusiastically chose “Jesus Barabbas”.
How strange this story really is becomes clear is when you realize that "Barabbas" is the Greek form of the Aramaic "bar Abba", which means "son of the Father." Thus "Jesus Barabbas" originally meant "Jesus the son of the Father", which would mean Jesus Christ: http://www.humanreligions.info/jesus_hby.html
(http://archive.is/C0zoI)
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Some musings on Genesis

Post by Firestarter »

Maybe I’m just a horrible thoughtcriminal, but when I read something, I try to think for myself, and sometimes reach strange conclusions that not many people subscribe to.


Cain – son of the “LORD”?
Genesis 4:1-2:
And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.
And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
I read here that Eve had gotten Cain “from the LORD”, which looks like she was inseminated by the “LORD”.

Genesis 4:25:
And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.
Adam and Eve had another son after the slewn Abel – Seth (when Adam was 130 years old). This again seems to confirm that Cain wasn’t the son of Adam (and that Abel had been Adam’s only son before Seth)…

Genesis 5:1-3:
This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, and after his image; and called his name Seth:
This looks to me like the most explicit reference in Genesis that Cain wasn’t the first son of Adam!


Who was Cain afraid of?
After Cain slew his (half)brother Abel, “the LORD” expels him from Eden and Cain replies…
Genesis 4:14-15:
Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me.
And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him.
Who was Cain afraid of when Adam and Eve and their children in Eden were the only humans on earth?!?


Who was Cain’s wife?
Then Cain went to Nod (east of Eden), and then...
Genesis 4:16-17:
And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.
And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.
I don’t read here that he took a wife with him, so conclude that she wasn’t the daughter of Eve, but he “found” her in (or on his way to) Nod…
The official explanation is that she must have been his sister though, because Adam and Eve where the first (and until Cain) only humans on earth (some call her “Awan” or that she could also have been his niece).
Or maybe Genesis 4:14 explains that many of the children of Adam and Eve had already left Eden?!?


Creating earth, before the universe
Genesis 1:11-19:
And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.
And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
And the evening and the morning were the third day.
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.
I read here that on the second day, God created earth, with plants and “saw that it was good”. Then on the third day, God created the sun, moon and stars…
Most Christians these days believe that the earth revolves around the sun in one year. This makes it strange (to say the least) that God would first create earth and then create the universe (including the sun)!


Great wind or Spirit of God?
I once posted on a Christian forum that the “Holy Spirit” doesn’t appear at all in the Tanach (Old Testament). I was told that it DOES appear...
Genesis 1:2
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
I disagree with this translation. Genesis 1 is about creating tangible things and think that the following translation is accurate:
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Great Wind moved upon the face of the waters.

The 2 Hebrew words that were translated as “Spirit of God” are:
Rûach
Elohim

Ruwach (# 7306 & 7307 & 7308) translates:
Wind
“Strong” Breath
Spirit (but only of sensible being).

Elohim (# 430) translates:
God
Magistrates
Angels
Great
Mighty.

Elohim is derived from: El (# 410) – Strength, Mighty, Almighty, God
El is derived from: Ayil (# 352) – Strength, Strong, Chief, Strong (tree), Mighty (man)

Another possible translation is "breath of God", but I think "great wind" fits better in the context of Genesis.

James Strong's “Greek and Hebrew dictionaries” (1890) describes how the Hebrew and Latin words were translated to English in the KJV Bible (the numbers above refer to the numbers used by Strong): https://archive.org/details/StrongsGree ... naries1890
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Re: Moloch, Baal

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Firestarter wrote: Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:33 pmIn Canaanite lore, Baal was the ruler of Heaven, and god of the sun, rain, thunder, fertility, and agriculture. The Ras Shamra tablets, discovered in northern Syria in 1958, suggest that at one time Baal was their Supreme god.
Baal Hammon was the supreme god of the Carthaginians.
Baal-worship included sex ritual that once included Israelites.
I wanted to post this before the pagan Christ "mass" celebration but didn't have access to the internet...


Here's some more information on the connection to the "Christian" Christmas celibration and the child sacrifice, sex cult for Baal.
Baal-Berith (the Babylonian Tammuz) was symbolized as an evergreen, or immortal tree. The Christmas tree, then decked with gold (deity), and silver (unlimited provision), represents the deified, reincarnation life of Nimrod, which has sprung forth from the dead tree stump.
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Since the earliest of times, trees, especially green evergreens, were worshipped by the pagans. To them it represented life and freshness. Since it was EVER green, it always had life. The trees were worshipped as symbols of life, fertility, sexual potency and reproduction (emphasis in original).
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Alexander Hislop had this to say about the origin of the Christ 'mass' tree:
The Christmas tree, now so common amoung us, was equally common in PAGAN ROME AND PAGAN EGYPT . In Egypt that tree was the palm tree; in Rome it was the fir; the palm tree denoting the Pagan Messiah as Baal-Tamar the fir referring to him as Baal-Berith. The mother of Adonis, the sun god and great mediatorial divinity, was mystically said to have been changed into a TREE, and when in that state to have brought forth her divine son. If the mother was a tree, the son must have been recognized as the 'Man the branch.'
And this entirely accounts for putting the Yule Log into the fire on Christmas-eve, and the appearance of the Christmas tree the next morning. The Christmas tree, as has been stated, was generally at Rome a different tree, even the fir; but the very same idea as was implied in the palm-tree was implied in the Christmas fir; for that covertly symbolized the new-born God as BAAL-BERITH, 'Lord of the Covenant,' and thus shadowed forth the perpetuity and everlasting nature of his power, now that after having fallen before his enemies, he has risen triumphant over them all.
Therefore, the 25th of December, the day that was observed at Rome as the day when the victorious god appeared on eath, was held as the Natalis invicti solis, 'The birthday of the Unconquerable Sun. Now the Yule Log is the dead stock of Nimrod, deified as the sun god, but cut down by his enemies; the Christmas tree is Nimrod redivivus - the slain god comes to life again.
http://www.a-voice.org/tidbits/xtree.htm
(https://archive.is/zxQvN)


Or see the following 3 excerpts from another interesting article,
Shortly after JESUS' death, persecutions of the Believers began as Satan began his plan to pollute what God had begun. Years later the Devil began a religious system that he hoped would replace the true church. The persecutions were temporarily stopped, and a deal was offered to both the Christians and pagans It went something like this: let's stop fighting over our religious differences and just Christianize the pagan gods and holidays. Both sides gave a little so they could all live in peace. By doing that, the Christian commitment and dedication to JESUS CHRIST only would have been seriously damaged. I beseech you brethren by the mercies of God that you approach this material with a heart and mind seeking the truth, and that you will prayerfully consider the facts contained within these pages. Remember that after the big compromise, the true Believers didn't accept the new system, but chose to go into hiding rather than deny their Lord and Savior.
.
Actually, Christmas (or CHRIST-mass) was the direct adoption of a heathen festival observed on December 24 and 25, in honor of the son of the Babylonian queen, Astarte. Observed for centuries BEFORE CHRIST, the Chaldeans called this "child day" or "yule day". (Does the expression, "yule time season" sound familiar)?
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Druids used holly and mistletoe in their ceremonies. They worshiped the oak tree. Gilded nuts and balls or ornaments symbolize the sun.
http://demonbuster.com/christmas.html
(https://archive.is/y6DDO)
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Re: Moloch, Baal

Post by notmartha »

Baal-Berith (the Babylonian Tammuz) was symbolized as an evergreen, or immortal tree. The Christmas tree, then decked with gold (deity), and silver (unlimited provision), represents the deified, reincarnation life of Nimrod, which has sprung forth from the dead tree stump.
Yes, and the Israelites were told not to follow the ways of the heathen:

Jeremiah 10:2-4 -
Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.
Throughout the OT of the KJV “green trees” in the “groves” were associated with idolatry:

Deuteronomy 12:2-3 -
Ye shall utterly destroy all the places, wherein the nations which ye shall possess served their gods, upon the high mountains, and upon the hills, and under every green tree: And ye shall overthrow their altars, and break their pillars, and burn their groves with fire; and ye shall hew down the graven images of their gods, and destroy the names of them out of that place.
1 Kings 14:23 -
For they also built them high places, and images, and groves, on every high hill, and under every green tree.
2 Kings 16:3-4 -
But he walked in the way of the kings of Israel, yea, and made his son to pass through the fire, according to the abominations of the heathen, whom the LORD cast out from before the children of Israel. And he sacrificed and burnt incense in the high places, and on the hills, and under every green tree.
2 Kings 17:10 -
And they set them up images and groves in every high hill, and under every green tree:
2 Chronicles 28:2-4 -
For he walked in the ways of the kings of Israel, and made also molten images for Baalim. Moreover he burnt incense in the valley of the son of Hinnom, and burnt his children in the fire, after the abominations of the heathen whom the LORD had cast out before the children of Israel. He sacrificed also and burnt incense in the high places, and on the hills, and under every green tree.
Isaiah 57:4-5 -
Against whom do ye sport yourselves? against whom make ye a wide mouth, and draw out the tongue? are ye not children of transgression, a seed of falsehood, Enflaming yourselves with idols under every green tree, slaying the children in the valleys under the clifts of the rocks?
Jeremiah 2:20 -
For of old time I have broken thy yoke, and burst thy bands; and thou saidst, I will not transgress; when upon every high hill and under every green tree thou wanderest, playing the harlot.
Jeremiah 3:6 -
The LORD said also unto me in the days of Josiah the king, Hast thou seen that which backsliding Israel hath done? she is gone up upon every high mountain and under every green tree, and there hath played the harlot.
Jeremiah 3:13 -
Only acknowledge thine iniquity, that thou hast transgressed against the LORD thy God, and hast scattered thy ways to the strangers under every green tree, and ye have not obeyed my voice, saith the LORD.
Ezekiel 6:13 -
Then shall ye know that I am the LORD, when their slain men shall be among their idols round about their altars, upon every high hill, in all the tops of the mountains, and under every green tree, and under every thick oak, the place where they did offer sweet savour to all their idols.
Another interesting tidbit is that throughout the OT of the KJV, the word ʾashērâ (Strong’s Hebrew #842) was translated as “grove(s)”. These groves were an abomination of the LORD. Strong’s Hebrew Concordance notes: “Asherah (or Astarte) a Phoenician goddess; also an image of the same :- grove.” Here are the verses, for reference:

Grove in KJV.pdf
(44.71 KiB) Downloaded 21 times

Some definitions, just for reference:

Webster’s Dictionary of the English Language, 1828
GROVE, noun
1. In gardening, a small wood or cluster of trees with a shaded avenue, or a wood impervious to the rays of the sun. A grove is either open or close; open, when consisting of large trees whose branches shade the ground below; close, when consisting of trees and underwood, which defend the avenues from the rays of the sun and from violent winds.
2. A wood of small extent. In America, the word is applied to a wood of natural growth in the field, as well as to planted trees in a garden, but only to a wood of small extent and not to a forest.
3. Something resembling a wood or trees in a wood.
Tall groves of masts arose in beauteous pride.
Smith’s Bible Dictionary, William Smith, 1884
GROVE

1. A word used in the Authorized Version, with two exceptions, to translate the mysterious Hebrew term Asherah, which is not a grove, but probably an idol or image of some kind. [ASHERAH] It is also probable that there was a connection between this symbol or image, whatever it was, and the sacred symbolic tree, the representation of which occurs so frequently on Assyrian sculptures.
2. The two exceptions noticed above are Gene 21:33 and 1 Sam 22:6 (margin). In the religions of the ancient heathen world groves play a prominent part. In the old times altars only were erected to the gods. It was thought wrong to shut up the gods within walls, and hence trees were the first temples; and from the earliest times groves are mentioned in connection with religious worship. Gene 12:6, 7; Deut. 11:30 Authorized Version "plain." the groves were generally found connected with temples, and often had the right of affording an asylum.
The Century Dictionary, an Encyclopedic Lexicon of the English Language, 1895
Grove

A group of trees of indefinite extent, but not large enough to constitute a forest; especially, such a group considered as furnishing shade for avenues or walks ; a small wood free from underbrush.

[In the authorized version of the Bible grove is used erroneously - (a) As a translation (following the Septuagint and Vulgate) of the Hebrew word Asherah (pl. Asherim). The revised version retains Asherah, “or obelisk” in the margin. It is now commonly understood as meaning a divinity or an image of a divinity worshiped by lewd rites, and as a variation in form of the name Astarte or Ashtaroth.
Easton's Bible Dictionary, Matthew George Easton, 1897
Grove

(1.) Heb. ʾasherah, properly a wooden image, or a pillar representing Ashtoreth, a sensual Canaanitish goddess, probably usually set up in a grove (2Ki 21:7; 2Ki 23:4). In the Revised Version the word "Asherah" (q.v.) is introduced as a proper noun, the name of the wooden symbol of a goddess, with the plurals Asherim (Ex 34:13) and Asheroth (Jdg 3:13).
The LXX. have rendered asherah in 2Ch 15:16 by "Astarte." The Vulgate has done this also in Jdg 3:7.
(2.) Heb. ʾeshel (Gen 21:33). In 1Sa 22:6 and 1Sa 31:13 the Authorized Version renders this word by "tree." In all these passages the Revised Version renders by "tamarisk tree." It has been identified with the Tamariscus orientalis, five species of which are found in Palestine.
(3.) The Heb. word ʾelon, uniformly rendered in the Authorized Version by "plain," properly signifies a grove or plantation. In the Revised Version it is rendered, pl., "oaks" (Gen 13:18; Gen 14:13; Gen 18:1; Gen 12:6; Deut 11:30; Jos 19:33). In the earliest times groves are mentioned in connection with religious worship. The heathen consecrated groves to particular gods, and for this reason they were forbidden to the Jews (Jer 17:3; Ezek 20:28).
What I find most interesting is that in many other translations of the Bible, the word “grove(s)” is replaced by some derivative of “Asherah pole”:

ashera instead of grove.pdf
(85.6 KiB) Downloaded 19 times

So who/what is Asherah and why would the translators want to replace the word “grove” with “Asherah pole”??

Smith’s Bible Dictionary, 1884
ASHERAH Ash'erah (straight), the name of a Phœnician goddess, or rather of the idol itself (Authorized Version "grove"). Asherah is closely connected with ASHTORETH and her worship, Judg 3:7 comp. Judg 2:3; 6:25; 1 Kin 18:19 Ashtoreth being, perhaps, the proper name of the goddess, whilst Asherah is the name of her image or symbol, which was of wood. See Judg 6:25-30; 2 Kin 23:14
Easton's Bible Dictionary, 1897
Asherah
And pl. Asherim in Revised Version, instead of "grove" and "groves" of the Authorized Version. This was the name of a sensual Canaanitish goddess Astarte, the feminine of the Assyrian Ishtar. Its symbol was the stem of a tree deprived of its boughs, and rudely shaped into an image, and planted in the ground. Such religious symbols ("groves") are frequently alluded to in Scripture (Ex 34:13; Jdg 6:25; 2Ki 23:6; 1Ki 16:33). These images were also sometimes made of silver or of carved stone ((2Ki 21:7); "the graven image of Asherah," R.V.). (See GROVE.).
Holman Christian Standard Bible - HCSB Bullet Notes
Asherah(s)/Asherah pole(s): A Canaanite fertility goddess who was the mother of the god Baal; also the wooden poles associated with the worship of her.
So was ashērâ a group of trees, including [ever]green trees, or a group of wooden poles cut from trees, or a goddess ??? The newspeak version of ashērâ would have you believe that the idolatry groves we are warned to avoid would have nothing to do with the Christmas tree rituals of cutting a tree from the forest and decking it with silver and gold.
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Re: Moloch, Baal

Post by notmartha »

Actually, Christmas (or CHRIST-mass) was the direct adoption of a heathen festival observed on December 24 and 25, in honor of the son of the Babylonian queen, Astarte. Observed for centuries BEFORE CHRIST, the Chaldeans called this "child day" or "yule day". (Does the expression, "yule time season" sound familiar)?

While I'm at it, who is Astarte?

The Century Dictionary, 1895 defines Astarte as:
The principal female divinity of the Phenicians, properly a chaste deity, goddess of the moon or of the heavens, but frequently confounded with the unchaste Ashera. She was the same as the Assyrian Istar. Also called Ashtoreth (Ashtareth, Astoreth), and, incorrectly, Ashtoroth (Ashtaroth), a plural form of Ashtoreth.
“Astarte” is not found in the KJV, but is found in:

God’s Word, 1995

Judges 2:13 -
They abandoned the LORD to serve the god Baal and the goddess Astarte.


1 Samuel 7:3 -
Samuel told the entire nation of Israel, “If you are returning to the LORD wholeheartedly, get rid of the foreign gods you have, including the statues of the goddess Astarte. Make a commitment to the LORD, and serve only him. Then he will rescue you from the Philistines.”
1 Samuel 7:4 -
So the Israelites got rid of the statues of Baal and Astarte and served only the LORD.


1 Kings 11:5 -
Solomon followed Astarte (the goddess of the Sidonians) and Milcom (the disgusting idol of the Ammonites).
1 Kings 11:33 -
I will do this because he has abandoned me and worshiped Astarte (the goddess of the Sidonians), Chemosh (the god of Moab), and Milcom (the god of Ammon). He has not followed my ways. He did not do what I consider right or keep my laws and decrees as his father David did.
2 Kings 23:13 -
The king made the illegal places of worship east of Jerusalem unclean. They were on the southern part of the Hill of Destruction. King Solomon of Israel had built them for Astarte (the disgusting goddess of the Sidonians), Chemosh (the disgusting god of Moab), and Milcom (the disgusting god of the Ammonites).
Septuagint, 1851

[Joshua] 24:33 –
And it came to pass afterwards that Eleazar the high-priest the son of Aaron died, and was buried in Gabaa of Phinees his son, which he gave him in mount Ephraim. In that day the children of Israel took the ark of God, and carried it about among them; and Phinees exercised the priest's office in the room of Eleazar his father till he died, and he was buried in his own place Gabaa: but the children of Israel departed every one to their place, and to their own city: and the children of Israel worshipped Astarte, and Astaroth, and the gods of the nations round about them; and the Lord delivered them into the hands of Eglom king of Moab and he ruled over them eighteen years
[Judges] 2:13 –
And they provoked the Lord, and forsook him, and served Baal and the Astartes.
[I Kings (I Samuel)] 31:10 –
And they set up his armour at the temple of Astarte, and they fastened his body on the wall of Baethsam.
[III Kings (1 Kings)] 11:5 –
and to Astarte the abomination of the Sidonians.
[III Kings (1 Kings)] 11:33 –
Because he forsook me, and sacrificed to Astarte the abomination of the Sidonians, and to Chamos, and to the idols of Moab, and to their king the abomination of the children of Ammon, and he walked not in my ways, to do that which was right before me, as David his father [did].
[IV Kings (2 Kings)] 23:13 –
And the king defiled the house that was before Jerusalem, on the right hand of the mount of Mosthath, which Solomon king of Israel built to Astarte the abomination of the Sidonians, and to Chamos the abomination of Moab, and to Moloch the abomination of the children of Ammon.
[II Chronicles] 15:16 –
And he removed Maacha his mother from being priestess to Astarte; and he cut down the idol, and burnt it in the brook of Kedron.
[II Chronicles] 24:18 –
And they forsook the house of the Lord God of their fathers, and served the Astartes and idols: and there was wrath upon Juda and Jerusalem in that day.
The Works of Flavius Josephus, Book 6, Chapter 14, Section 8
On the next day, when the Philistines came to strip their enemies that were slain, they got the bodies of Saul and of his sons, and stripped them, and cut off their heads; and they sent messengers all about their country, to acquaint them that their enemies were fallen; and they dedicated their armor in the temple of Astarte, but hung their bodies on crosses at the walls of the city Bethshun, which is now called Scythepolls.
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Re: Moloch, Baal

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notmartha wrote: Thu Jan 07, 2021 8:19 amYes, and the Israelites were told not to follow the ways of the heathen:
It looks to me like you're angry. I hope not with me?!?
I haven't had a Christmas tree in over 20 years, although in retrospect the "mystical" religions that I favoured for much of those 20 years could be even worse...

I don't even understand how these Christmas celebrations that are really in imitation of worshipping Odin and Baal could have any "power.
I could understand that for Satanists these kind of rituals show that Satan is really more powerful than God.


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notmartha wrote: Thu Jan 07, 2021 8:42 amWhile I'm at it, who is Astarte?
All of these different names certainly make it more difficult to follow (I find "translating" names of people especially disgusting, why do English-speaking people translate Latin names?).
Firestarter wrote: Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:18 pmWhat does this inverted pyramid mean?!? This all leads to the child sacrifice, fertility cult of Baal.
Baal was the male deity of the cult, and Asherah was the female. Asherah goes by several names, including: Astarte, Ashtoreth, Atargatis, Athirat, Venus, Isis, Juno, Ishtar, the queen of heaven, Aphrodite, and Hadad.
The inverted triangle represents the vagina of Asherah; see the following image of Asherah.
Image
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My reason for once again looking into the Baal worshipping was the Trump association (I sometimes find it difficult to figure out which is the most relevant topic to post certain information in).
Firestarter wrote: Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:18 pmTrump Tower blatantly shows that Donald worships the horned one.
See the inverted pyramid at Trump Tower, made up of a grove of trees (trees represent the feminine). The inverted pyramid represents the female Asherah, while the fertility feast for Baal always took place with a grove of trees…
Also look to the top of Trump Tower, where there are the 7 columns, which represent the 7 pillars rising for Baal!
Image

Also count the trees on the sides of the inverted pyramid.
Each side has 6 trees; so Trump’s inverted triangle represents 666.
(...)
http://web.archive.org/web/202010220351 ... hronicles/
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1418#p69297
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Re: Moloch, Baal

Post by notmartha »

Firestarter wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 5:27 pm
notmartha wrote: Thu Jan 07, 2021 8:19 amYes, and the Israelites were told not to follow the ways of the heathen:
It looks to me like you're angry. I hope not with me?!?
I haven't had a Christmas tree in over 20 years, although in retrospect the "mystical" religions that I favoured for much of those 20 years could be even worse...
Really?! I even used pretty pink text so my annoyance didn't show through. :lol: No, I'm not angry, but I do get annoyed at this time of the year when people who call themselves Christians ignore the blatantly obvious because "it is fun" or because "that's not what it means to me" or because "we need traditions to hold us together" or because "it makes me happy" etc. etc. etc. Then they criticize me for not celebrating the pagan holidays.

Mark 7:7-9 (KJV)
7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.


<rant over> :)

A couple of years ago I was assembling a long, detailed post about symbolism surrounding Trump, but lost it and never went back. You covered a lot of the issues. As I recall there was also something about the Trump Tower being 666 feet tall, and one of his buildings (maybe the tower, maybe not) being on 666 Fifth Avenue.
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Re: Moloch, Baal

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notmartha wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 1:26 pmReally?! I even used pretty pink text so my annoyance didn't show through. :lol: No, I'm not angry, but I do get annoyed at this time of the year when people who call themselves Christians ignore the blatantly obvious because "it is fun" or because "that's not what it means to me" or because "we need traditions to hold us together" or because "it makes me happy" etc. etc. etc. Then they criticize me for not celebrating the pagan holidays.
Annoyed sounds soo much better than angry (over here, pink is associated with the LGBT agenda, so I just had to check)...
Public shaming is really part of the power of indoctrination. Please be careful... if you show your disgust for these "Christian" rituals, you could be seen as a horrible "thoughtcriminal"!

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notmartha wrote: Thu Jan 07, 2021 8:19 amSo was ashērâ a group of trees, including [ever]green trees, or a group of wooden poles cut from trees, or a goddess ??? The newspeak version of ashērâ would have you believe that the idolatry groves we are warned to avoid would have nothing to do with the Christmas tree rituals of cutting a tree from the forest and decking it with silver and gold.
My simple logic is obviously insufficient to grasp the (hidden) meanings in the Bible, but it doesn't make any sense to me that all "groves" had to be destroyed, just because pagans were worshipping trees.
My best guess is that the Hebrew Ashera was really a specific type of "Ashera grove" (instead of the general "grove").
Maybe an "Ashera grove" could look like an inverted triangle on a slope. Something like this...
Firestarter wrote: Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:18 pmSee the inverted pyramid at Trump Tower, made up of a grove of trees (trees represent the feminine). The inverted pyramid represents the female Asherah, while the fertility feast for Baal always took place with a grove of trees…
Also look to the top of Trump Tower, where there are the 7 columns, which represent the 7 pillars rising for Baal!
Image
.

My main reason to NOT believe the "Ashera pole" translation is that the "pole" is a phallus symbol, while "Ashera" is feminine (not counting trannies)...
These phallus symbol poles are often placed in the middle of a circle, where the circle represents the feminine.
See for example (with the Beehive/Bijenkorf in the background!).
Firestarter wrote: Tue Apr 30, 2019 4:46 pmSemiramis decided to memorialize his penis by erecting an “obelisk”. These obelisks can be found all over the world, for example in Washington DC on St. Peter’s Square in front of the Vatican and in the City of London.
See for example the giant phallus symbol on the Dam in my home town of Amsterdam.
Image
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In the Dutch 1951 translation of the Bible that I have in my home, Ashera is mostly translated with "gewijde palen" - sacred trees.
Sometimes "beeld van Asjera" - image of Ashera.

In my Dutch translation of the following "Ashera" is translated with "Asjera's".
Judges 3:7 - And the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the LORD, and forgat the LORD their God, and served Baalim and the groves.
.
1 Kings 14:23 - For they also built them high places, and images, and groves, on every high hill, and under every green tree.
You can't build a "grove" under "every green tree" can you?!?

This is also peculiar.
1 Kings 15:13 - And also Maachah his mother, even her he removed from being queen, because she had made an idol in a grove; and Asa destroyed her idol, and burnt it by the brook Kidron.
.
2 Chronicles 15:16 - And also concerning Maachah the mother of Asa the king, he removed her from being queen, because SHE HAD MADE AN IDOL IN A GROVE: and Asa CUT DOWN HER IDOL, and stamped it, and burnt it at the brook Kidron.
If "Ashera" means "Ashera pole", the "Ashera pole" would be an "idol", which could be made in a "grove". But this shows that "grove" can't be the "pole" (idol)!
But which 2 different Hebrew words are they and is it "in a grove" or "and a grove"?!?


The following was written by a fan of the KJV translation of the Bible, arguing that the general "grove" is a fitting translation. But I find the arguments against it stronger...

Two different Hebrew words are translated as "GROVE" in the KJV translation of the Bible:
- ashen-rah (#842), some 39 times and is always translated as "grove" in the KJV (or KJB?).
- eh-shel (#815), is only found 3 times in the Hebrew Old Testament.

To me this sort of "confirms" that the Hebrew "ashen-rah" was really a special type of "grove" or some sort of worshipping pole (instead of the general "grove").
And I guess that "grove" is really a correct translation of the Hebrew "eh-shel"...

The following is (the KJV translations of) one of the occurrences of "eh-shel" (# 815).
Genesis 21:33 - And Abraham planted a GROVE in Beersheba, and called there on the name of the LORD, the everlasting God.
.

I sort of agree with the following quote...
Bible corrector Al Maxey defended the NIV translation of the Bible:
These (King James Bible) translators also did not know that the "Asherah" was a wooden idol representing a Canaanite goddess, so they translated the word repeatedly as meaning a "grove" of trees. In I Kings 16:33 they state, "And Ahab made A GROVE” which provoked the Lord God to anger.
In point of fact, Ahab made an IDOL here (the Asherah); his sin was idolatry, not planting a grove of trees!! God was not condemning "a grove," but rather an idol. I actually heard someone refer to this passage as "proof" that planting a "grove" will cause one to be eternally lost!!! How sad!
https://brandplucked.webs.com/groveorashterothpole.htm
(https://archive.is/utF7j)

-------------------------------

Tree worshipping is an interesting (sub)topic in its own right (I've previously posted on the "Tree of life" that goes back to the Sumerian religion).
The following book describes examples of tree worshipping. See the following 2 excerpts...
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For there is no country in the world where the tree was ever more ardently worshipped than it was in ancient Palestine. Amongst the Canaanites every altar to the god had its sacred tree beside it, and when the Israelites established local sanctuaries under their influence, they set up their altar under a green tree, and planted beside it as its indispensable accompaniment an ashêra, which was either a living tree or a tree-like post, and not a “grove,” as rendered in the Authorised Version. This ashêra was undoubtedly worshipped as a sacred symbol of the deity. Originally it appears to have been associated with Ashtoreth or Astarte, the Syrian Istar, the revolting character of whose worship perhaps explains the excessive bitterness of the biblical denunciations.[8]
But the ashêra was also erected by the altars of other gods, and in pre-prophetic days even beside that of Jehovah Himself, whence it may be concluded that “in early times tree-worship had such a vogue in Canaan, that the sacred tree or the pole, its surrogate, had come to be viewed as a general symbol of deity.”[9] The great antiquity of the cult in Syria was recognised in the local traditions, for an old Phoenician cosmogony, quoted by Eusebius, states that “the first men consecrated the plants shooting out of the earth, and judged them gods, and worshipped them, and made meat and drink offerings to them.”[10]
In addition to the ashêra, the Chaldaean symbol of the sacred tree between its supporters was also familiar to the Phoenicians, and is found wherever their art penetrated, notably in Cyprus and on the archaic pottery of Corinth and Athens.[11] It is highly probable that both these sacred symbols had a common origin, but the connection must have been lost sight of in later times, for we find Ezekiel, to whom the prophetic denunciations of the ashêra must have been familiar, decorating the temple of his vision with designs evidently derived from the Chaldaean sacred tree, “a palm-tree between a cherub and a cherub.”[12] A similar ornamentation with palm-trees and cherubim, it will be remembered, had been used in the temple built by Solomon.[13]
(...)

In Germany the Christmas-tree can be traced back more or less in its present form to the beginning of the seventeenth century, when an unnamed writer, in some extremely fragmentary notes, tells us that it was the custom at Strasburg to set up fir-trees in the houses at Christmas, and to deck them with roses of coloured paper, apples, etc.[374]
The next mention of it occurs half a century later in the writings of Professor Dannhauer, a celebrated theologian, also living in Strasburg.[375] “Amongst the other absurdities,” he writes, “with which men are often more busied at Christmas than with the Word of God, there is also the Christmas or fir-tree, which they erect in their houses, hang it with dolls and sweetmeats, and then shake it and cause it to shed its flowers.
I know not the origin of the custom, it is a child’s game.... Far better were it to lead the children to the spiritual cedar, Christ Jesus.” The reprobation of the Strasburg preacher was echoed by other divines, and to this cause probably the Christmas-tree owed its slow diffusion throughout Germany. The theological dislike of it, however, as it turned out, was ill-advised, for eventually the Christmas-tree displaced other popular observances of a far less innocent nature.
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J. H. Philpot - The Sacred Tree (2014): https://www.gutenberg.org/files/47215/4 ... 7215-h.htm
(https://archive.is/XeZyK)
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