Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Discussion on creating and maintaining Conflicts of Law
Thomas Jeffrey
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Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by Thomas Jeffrey » Sun May 19, 2013 4:32 pm

The issue of Christian Jural societies is one that has been troubling me for a few years now. Since my Calling to Christ in the early to mid 90's, when Freedom Conferences were sweeping across the country and the idea of Jural societies were rekindled here in America, I have followed the forming and subsequent failure of a few of these societies.

That had left me with the conclusion that God (YHWH) did not want these societies to succeed, perhaps it was not in His plan anymore. Perhaps the days of Christians coming together in communities with the rule of His Law were over.

But this just doesn't compute with the promises, blessings, and commands of our Lord and Savior , Jesus, the Christ. Hence my dilemma.

Over the last year or so my interest in this subject has been renewed and I've spent a good amount of time studying, praying, and reflecting on this dilemma trying to put the pieces together. Recently, a thought came to me that seemed to make sense and tie it all together. I'd like to present my thoughts on this subject for your review and consideration. Please bear with me... I was was late for the bus when the Lord handed out Blessings in eloquent writing techniques.

If one studies the truth about the cause of the Civil war and what the end result was, and compares it to prophecy in Scripture, it appears to be clear that YHWH planned for the North to win so that Roman law would become the law of this modern nation. The modern Roman style democracy is iron mixed with miry clay. The martial arm of the law (iron) is used to protect the commercial arm of the law (miry clay). All modern wars are waged to protect commercial interests and to spread democracy in the aftermath.

I don't believe for a moment that the good and brave men of the southern States died in vain. I believe they accomplished exactly everything that YHWH placed them in this land to do, until it was time for Him to take them Home. They established and nurtured the Christian common Law, their Christian culture and daily way of Christian life here in America.

Without that foundation in place, all semblance of Christianity would have been wiped out of this land decades ago. However, the culture and the way of life of the South's ecclesiastic society have been slowly eroded away, bit by bit, through the last few generations.

So where does that leave the contemporary Christian who is called out of the world's ways to lead a faithful life in the name of our Lord? I certainly don't believe he's going to find answers in the so-called “churches” of today. The liberal teachings that have infected the mainstream “churches” in this country are an abomination. (The Great Falling Away?) However, those of us that want to return to Scriptural Law are trying to re-learn those old ways with nothing but books, and not much of a chance at practical application. But our Lord always leaves a door open, right? I believe so.

This may be where it all starts to make sense. Please stick with me through this analogy. Lets say there is a teenager who has read every book on driving, and has seen their parents do it a thousand times but has never been behind the wheel. Modern attempts at Jural societies are like putting this youngster behind the wheel of a car in a large freeway interchange in the middle of a large city and asking them to drive safely home into the suburbs without an accident or getting pulled over by the cops.

Please allow me explain. Reading every book or paper on a subject such as the rules of the road, or how a steering wheel, brakes, and accelerator are used to control the car can never give the experience required to make that journey safely. Without learning and practicing the basic skills of operating and controlling the car, say in a high school parking lot, one can never know the little nuances of driving that are necessary to drive safely on the road with other cars in rush hour. How much pressure on the brake pedal does it take to slow the car but not stop it? How much pressure on the accelerator or steering wheel is too much or too little for a given situation? Not to mention how to observe and adjust for other drivers on the road. These are things that experienced drivers take for granted. The next time you're behind the wheel, try paying attention to how often you unconsciously move the steering wheel slightly left and right making adjustments to the road. It's staggering.

Maybe the basic skills of Christian life are what is missing in the modern attempts at Jural societies. We still have the foundation of Christian common Law, but perhaps we need to re-learn and nurture the Christian culture and the Christian way of life. I believe in looking at how the early Christians did things to help understand the Christian way of life. If we take a look at the first Christian ecclesias, ecclesia at Ephesus, ecclesia at Corinth, etc., we may be able to understand how they were able to survive and grow.

My goal in the next couple of paragraphs is not an attempt to give you a lesson on Scripture, but to ask you to consider the following as it pertains to basic Christian ways of life. The early assemblies of believers met in their homes. Many homes in cities and surrounding areas were used as meeting places. Imagine the fellowship, the bonding, the love and support for one another, and the interactive method of study and discussion that one could only find in such an intimate setting. Couple that with the Holy Spirit being poured into the very fabric of their lives and then imagine how wonderful it must have been!

These guys knew God's word! All of the knowledge, edification, manners, habits, and social graces that would form from that kind of brotherly love toward one another made up the basic practices of the Christian way of life which became natural to them. And their children grew up with the same common knowledge, teachings, principles, and practices.

Now compare the above to your average American Jural society member (who is well above average with respect to studying the Word of God than your local big-box church goer). How many, without looking, can identify the three main Blessings that YHWH promised to Abraham? Which ones have been fulfilled? Which ones have not? (by the way, that's a trick question) What is the sign or seal of YHWH's covenant with Abraham? The sign or seal of YHWH's covenant with Israel on Mt. Sinai? What is the New Covenant? Who are the specific parties to the New Covenant? What is the sign or seal of the New Covenant? With regards to the penny in the famous “Render unto Caesar” quote in Matthew 22:20, Caesar gets what and God gets what, and why? These are some very basic questions that each and every Christian should know without having to think about it. The answers to a few of these questions form the basic tenets of our faith. (BTW... How did you do?)

Please don't blast me for disparaging those who wish to start a Jural society. That is not my intent. I applaud those brothers and sisters for the work they have done. I only wish to point out the immaturity of the modern body of Christ. Law isn't the only aspect of Scripture that we should be concerned with. There are blessings, promises, social instruction, etc., the list goes on.

Now to the door that our Lord has left open to us: Could it be in the form of House churches? (or more correctly called “assemblies”). I believe so. I submit to you that we are not ready to drive the car during rush hour. It may be that the Lord wishes for us to learn or regain the basics of the Christian way of life before jumping into heavy traffic. The body of Christ needs to mature through fellowship, participatory study and discussion, and brotherly love. The best way to do that may be from small, intimate assemblies in which we can regain that Way which has been lost. You cannot get that from the Tuesday night “Men's Study” at the local Youth Ministry Center. The whole family needs to be involved in the study and discussions with other families in an organized way according to Scripture.

When several of these assemblies are mature enough and wish to come together for whatever reason they choose, then perhaps our Lord will be there with them and enable them to prosper as a larger whole.

There is only one book I've read on the subject, and when it comes to books, articles, audio, and other “ministry” material, I can can be one of the harshest critics. There is so much crap and half-truth garbage out there that I've had a lot of practice of weeding it out. However, the book I mention is titled, “House Church – Simple, Strategic, Scriptural” written by Steve Atkerson. I highly recommend it. In fact I have listened to some of his audio ministries on Sermon Audio to see where he's coming from, and for what it's worth, he gets my two thumbs up.

I pray that I have provided some food for thought. Please let me know if you think I'm a crackpot who should be wearing a tin foil hat, or if there is something here that may warrant more discussion.

In either case, I humbly submit the above for your review and consideration in the Name of our Lord and Savior, Jesus, the Christ.

May the Lord richly Bless you.
Thomas
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Re: Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by editor » Mon May 20, 2013 12:06 am

This is a fine contribution to the forum, Thomas. Thank you.

I really appreciate your analogy of taking a car out onto a busy highway, with no experience other than having read some books on the subject.

I can relate to this. We were primarily three families who came together to start Christ county. Over time, we grew to twenty. We had peripheral support from literally hundreds of other families in the patriot community.

We scoured the Bible for procedure, and this was our primary guide. We looked to history. We learned something important-- there's a good reason that it's so rare for a group of people to try something like this. It's hard. If there was ever a how-to manual on how to form a government from scratch, it was long ago destroyed by existing governments who didn't want any competition.

I think you are spot-on when you say it's important for people to begin by understanding what a Christian way of life should be. Without this knowledge, people have very little chance of success. I speak from the perspective of one who presided over a thriving jural society which ultimately failed.

The first thing people must learn is self-reliance. Even if you are one of those people who thinks constantly of helping others, self-reliance must come first. The biggest single thing you can do in a crisis to help your neighbors, is to not become a burden on them.

When you are self-reliant, you are in a much better position to help your neighbor.

Charity is a blessing, but only when it is voluntary. Forced charity, such as the secular government's habit of stealing from A to give to B, is not really charity. It is simply institutionalized theft. Government welfare becomes a system of dependency and control, and we must never give it legitimacy in our minds. Please, please, if you have not done it, read The Law, by Frederic Bastiat. This book is free in our Reading Room, and will only take one evening to read aloud to your entire family.

At Christ county, most of us had already jumped these hurtles. We were a mostly like-minded group, who all believed we were engaged in very important work. You may find it ironic that we found our most important work was in creating a mechanism for the lawful settlement of disputes.

Anyone who studies our Court Rules, found in the Christ county Vault, will see that we established a lawful Christian court system which will work in real life-- out on the highway in rush-hour, so to speak. But only if there are enough living souls to participate.

The ultimate irony is that it was an irreconcilable dispute which finally resulted in Christ county's dissolution.

We had been infiltrated, over time, by at least five men from various branches of secular government law enforcement. Most of them were easy to spot, because they eventually tried to persuade us to do something stupid and unlawful. All of those men failed completely to have even the slightest influence on our direction.

During this time, we had been making inroads with other groups. Formal, and informal meetings with black leaders, and Indian council leaders. We knew that our influence would increase with numbers. More and more people were signing on with our voluntary courts.

The man who finally succeeded in dividing us, came in the guise of a pastor. He started at the periphery of our group, and in small, seemingly insignificant steps, led some of our members into "Identity". For those of you who don't know about Christian Identity, I would describe it as: "A White Race belief system which teaches that white people are better than everyone else, for the purpose of dividing people into smaller groups, thus making them easier to control and conquer." Feel free to quote me on this.

By the time I saw what was happening, it was too late. The "pastor" didn't get to everyone, but he managed to cause enough division to bring us down. Nothing I said could bring people back into the fold.

I'm certain this pastor was a shill for the FBI, though I could never prove it. This all happened just a few months after the Southern Poverty Law Center stated that Christ county was the "...most dangerous domestic group with a presence on the Internet."

I'm not sure if I've stayed on point with this-- maybe it's turned into something of a rant. I pray the reader will find a way to make use of it.
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Thomas Jeffrey
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Re: Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by Thomas Jeffrey » Mon May 20, 2013 9:16 pm

Thank you for your response, Gregory. It sure sounds like you guys got hammered with “Ravenous Wolves”! I am truly sorry to hear that happened, especially in such an insidious manner. I’m sure Christ county was a great undertaking and a rewarding experience.

However, I had to chuckle in response to your group being labeled as “…the most dangerous domestic group with a presence on the Internet”. It never ceases to amaze me how these “Anti-hate” groups tend to express the most hate.

The issue of infiltrators does appear to have been the most common demise of recent Jural Societies. I agree with you that the provisional government does not like competition, and they have become masters in the art of dividing and conquering. The KGB, the CIA, and other covert groups have been doing it for years in other parts of the world as well as in the home land.

Let me bounce another thought your way… Perhaps one of the mistakes that we can learn from is the use of the “Public Notice of Assembly”. If memory serves correctly from the Reading Room, Christ county published one. So did the other Jural societies that I followed. The Public Notice seems to be a common, even prescribed, method of giving the public some form of notice or declaration that there is a new organization forming.

But what does the Notice actually do? Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t it another way of stating that “a new organized body politic, with the express purpose of Administering a law foreign to the provisional government of this land, has come to town and our headquarters are at Exhibiton Hall, Main Street, Anytown, USA”? Looking at this way, I think we can see how that might be construed as a threat to the provisional government.

Maybe it’s not necessary to give such notice to the Public. Could you imagine Paul having to hang a Notice of Assembly at the local synagogue or Roman palace stating that a new Christian Assembly was forming at Frank’s house? How quickly do you think Frank would have had to move out of town?

There would be no need of public notice with Assemblies of four or five families gathering at someone’s home. No public notice would be required, even though the cause of the Church is a public cause. An Assembly in a public meeting place, however, may raise some eyebrows, and give cause for a Public Notice.

What do you think?
Thomas
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Re: Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by VickiAmerica » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:32 am

Having been discouraged with a jural society I, and other Christian sovereigns, have been involved with, we would really like to start a "Los Angeles Jural Society". From what I understand, beyond the obvious understanding of God's Word, including Mosaic and Levitical law, and the teachings of Jesus, we will need at least 12 people as jurists, and a Clerk, Judge Ana, in Alaska, has laid out several other entities that must be involved and, of course, there are conflicting suggestions from other patriots and sovereigns.

Can someone please give me the general outline of WHO (what stations) and HOW MANY (in total) would need to be involved to create a jural society in accordance with God's Word and with God's blessings?

And, I do agree with your posts . . . too many Christians are still on milk instead of meat. As bad as that is, it's completely understandable in that God forewarned us of the false preachers, cults, pastors, teachers, and religions that were to come . . . and it sure looks like they're here!!! AND they're really good at indoctrinating our nation's children early on. Lord Lord, what a mess.
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Re: Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by notmartha » Fri Jul 01, 2016 2:01 pm

The Organic documents for Christ county, kingdom of God are found here:

http://www.lawfulpath.com/ref/ccvault/index.shtml

These may help you in your organizational endeavor.
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Re: Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by VickiAmerica » Thu Jul 07, 2016 9:06 am

I believe you're in California, Greg, but are you in Los Angeles? We need a Christian judge fully familiar with God's law. And thank you for the links!
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Re: Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by editor » Thu Jul 07, 2016 3:11 pm

I'm not in California. Any help I can offer will have to be online.
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Re: Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by VickiAmerica » Fri Jul 08, 2016 11:18 am

I'm thinking of setting up the JS much like a corporation (ugh) would be set up -- with specific officers and/or people for specific tasks . . . maybe 2 or 3 judges, 2 or 3 Clerks, someone in charge of creating case summaries, someone familiar with habeas corpus to get our members out of jail (if necessary), someone to lead prayer chains, etc. Lofty ideas, but we have to try.

With respect to my question on another post, does everyone involved have to be in Los Angeles? Or can we get some great Christians Patriots from other states? Perhaps all trials by jury (if necessary) can be held via email instead of in person . . . . I just haven't researched that far yet. What do you think, Greg?
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Re: Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by editor » Fri Jul 08, 2016 3:25 pm

Civil cases could conceivably be settled by remote jurors and/or judges, provided that rules of procedure were carefully drafted in advance and made clear to all parties, and that voluntary jurisdiction was secured over all parties prior to commencement. The key in this instance being "voluntary".

Jurisdiction is always the key sticking point, no matter the forum. Court rules must always clearly set forth the means of securing jurisdiction. I wrote a detailed explanation of jurisdiction here. If a jural society's court deals exclusively in cases between members who have already granted jurisdiction as a condition of membership, then no problem. If you explicitly secure voluntary jurisdiction over all parties at the time of filing and/or prior to commencement, then no problem. But if you're trying to sue a judge, or other officer of a foreign jurisdiction (if they are not members of your jural society, then they are foreigners with respect to the court), over their objections, or without their participation, then your options are limited.

I've been working on adapting Christ county's Court Rules to be used by a private judicial council. I've been contemplating how a remote court, with officers located far from each other, might be able to actually function. It's harder than I'd expected at first glance. As long as jurisdiction is voluntarily secured, your possible options are limited only by your imagination. But possible and practical are two different things, and a court must be fair and unbiased if it is to maintain any credibility.

It's been a couple of months since I've actively worked on this project-- I had to set it aside temporarily to deal with more pressing matters. I expect to resume work in the fall. When I get something I think is functional, I'll submit it to this forum for comments, and probably do some re-writes as a result. We have some good minds here.
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Re: Christian Jural Societies: A Thing of the Past?

Post by VickiAmerica » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:13 am

Oh THANK YOU! It is so incredibly difficult to find true sovereigns and patriots here . . . after all, it IS Los Angeles, a gruesome sanctuary city where the cops are told to 'stand down' at every possible twist and turn. I have had an extremely hard time finding enough REAL Americans in this city, but have an overflow of patriots from other states. In act, I have 5,000 of them just on Facebook, as well as other social networks. If THEY could be included, we may be able to get things started. I will read your link and see if I can come up with anything, at least temporarily, to start our jural society here. This city is a tough one . . . . "City of Angels" (but it doesn't define WHAT type of' 'angels"). Not the Godly ones, for sure.

Every step of the way in my journey has been a battle. Now, finally, that I have the Liens against the corrupt judges, the County Recorder won't record them. Thus, a new battle starts with the Recorder. It never ends. Satan is really really good at what he does! He's already been sentenced and he knows it, so because his time is short, he's working hard against God's people. Pfffft!
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